Track light install. Wires need to go OUTSIDE the drywall!

[Scrib]

Our family room has a very high ceiling. During the evening, it is difficult to put light into such a large room. We have a couple of floor lamps, and a table lamp... So, I began to think...

I would like to run some lights along a ledge that exists about 10-12 feet above the floor.

Picture just before me moved our crap in last year... Freshly painted.


You can see the ledge above the second set of windows... What I want to do is center some sort of a track light on the center window, hanging down from the ledge.

The problem is getting power up there. I made the mistake of not having a junction box installed with power up there. DOH.

So, I think my only option is use the stuff that you can anchor on the drywall and it can be painted.

Like...



http://www.wiremold.com

I would run this stuff along the corners and into the outlet that is already switched. You can see of the switched outlets along the bottom of the beige-painted walls.


I think that's my only option, no?

I don't think it'll look that bad, considering I'll paint the channels the same color as the walls.

Thoughts???

[chef chris]

I'd try to put it in the wall eric...that room looks too nice for that conduit.

You may even benefit from building a small soffit to hide the socket/wires. Aside from the obvious mess...cutting into & patching the drywall from the soffit to the switch won't be that big a deal.

[Scrib]

I'm not sure how it'd go about hiding it all. All the walls are insulated, studs every 16 inches. How can one snake wire, etc through all that? I just doesn't seem possible aside from ripping out quite a bit of sheetrock.

[DRM600]

what about placing tube lights on top of the ledge to bounce the light into the room? you could build a panel or something to hide the fixtures.

i agree with running the wires though the walls. they make long flexible drill bits specifically for drilling holes though studs in finished walls for electrical installations. i imagine that only small access holes will be made in the sheetrock.

[doopstr]

Don't run that conduit. It will make your nice new house seem old.

I don't think you have enough windows in that room

[JLatimer]

Can you see the ledge from the top? What I would do is run the wires up inside the red wall on the right - your could pull your power from the outlet on that wall - there probably isnt insulation there. Then run your conduit on the top of the ledge where you cant see it as well over to the middle of the ledge, then cut into the ledge to put your light box in.

Even if you can see from the top - you could cover the conduit with interest pieces (art).

[Scrib]

Ya, you can see up there, as you can look out from the second floor over the room (top right of the picture). This picture doesn't do it justice, but you can get an idea.



But maybe you're on to something. I may actually run it along the other corner and up, as it's a much softer color and something like this would blend better into the wall (when painted).

We already have a bunch of knicknacks and crap up there, so that would help hide things better.

Question is... With no junction boxes up there... Would that make a difference in mounting some sort of a light?

[ric]

You'd be surprise how much can be fished through a wall; I've had wire fished through three floors of 188's plaster on lath...... just requires some patience. It would be costly, however.

The notion of fishing through the adjacent wall, which would not have insulation, makes a great deal of sense, then start the tracklight butted up to the side wall. If you run it on the ledge, while you will see it, it will be minimalized. I'd run the track the entire length of the ledge, even if you don't intend to use all of it, just to create a consistent visual line. If you do work with the ledge, you might consider light fixtures that provide both down and uplight..... to get a general diffuse glow. And - since you're doing this from scratch - put it on a dimmer, so you can play with the "mood" of the lighting.

As an alternative, consider purchasing some floor torchieres, probably powered with some high-intensity quartz light; some of these have quite a "pitch" in terms of their light "throw". These would cast uplight into the space, create a diffused soft light by the time they hit the upper portions.

The one concern with tracklghting in the location you propose is that one will inevitably look up into the light source when you look up.......

[Scrib]

Originally Posted by ric

As an alternative, consider purchasing some floor torchieres, probably powered with some high-intensity quartz light; some of these have quite a "pitch" in terms of their light "throw". These would cast uplight into the space, create a diffused soft light by the time they hit the upper portions.

Not familiar with these... Any pictures or links?

[Scrib]

Right now we have these REALLY old onyx base floor lamps in there... I put some flourescent bulbs in there which are the equivalent of 125W. I was wondering if they make littkle flood lights that would work. I don't need the light to go up, rather out from the light...

[JLatimer]

The floor torchieres (basically a bowl at the top of a pole) that ric is talking about are probably close to your onyx base floor lamps. Some use halogen bulbs and can be as much as 300watts. If placed in the corners they will throw a good plume of light out on the walls that will reflect into the room to overall brighten the room.

[ric]

Originally Posted by JLatimer

The floor torchieres (basically a bowl at the top of a pole) that ric is talking about are probably close to your onyx base floor lamps. Some use halogen bulbs and can be as much as 300watts. If placed in the corners they will throw a good plume of light out on the walls that will reflect into the room to overall brighten the room.

http://www.arcadianlighting.com/torc...?source=google

is one link with fixtures to suit every taste...... Halogen or quartz light can produce a significantly greater light quantity than a flourescent or incandescent fixture. The light source is very durable. The downside is that they do become quite hot and fluorescent light manufacturers have all sorts of gory stories of fire and danger. However, I've had a floor torciere with a 300watt lumensource for about twelve years, and other than cleaning out the occassional dead bugs, it's fine. It casts a good uplight for the room it is in, and when we need quiet ambient light, that's all we need.

The other downside would be if you would be looking down into the fixture from a balcony on the floor above your high space. The light source is quite intense.

Key to the light spread is the design of the shade or baffle. THe wider the "saucer" and the inner protective ring, the broader and more diffuse the light.

[ric]

http://lightingbygregory.com/Merchan...gory_Code=FLOS

The Toio fixture, located on the bottom left, is essentially a car hedlamp in a vertical light fixture, and was a "signature" fixture for lofts in SOHO in the '80's. Pretty techy, and a bit edgy

http://lightingbygregory.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Category_Code=FLOShttp://www.lightology.com/index.cfm/method-light.store_subcat/dept-Floor/lcat_id-1/subdept-Floor?CFID=477471&CFTOKEN=b1e0a71ed78686d7-4E90B937-5022-83C7-DD9407314EDFEE84&jsessionid=d63026136fa9D$7EsT$A

THis retailer carries some high-end, contemporary edgy stuff.

http://www.farreys.com/lighting/port...itional_2.html
and this guy establishes that you can spend just as much on a traditional configuration.....

[Scrib]

OK... I thought what you were referring to Ric was what we already have.

You're links confirmed it. That is basically what we have, just a much old stlye.

[ric]

Originally Posted by Scrib

OK... I thought what you were referring to Ric was what we already have.

You're links confirmed it. That is basically what we have, just a much old stlye.

yep, the difference is in the light source. THe halogen or quartz light output is substantially higher. Just suggested it because it's the cheapest.

[teg_to_bike]

Why not recessed lighting in the ceiling? My parent's house has a very high ceiling in thier family room with recessed lighting. It works well and lights up the entire room. The installation is fairly simple... assuming you have a electrical box up there.

[Scrib]

Originally Posted by teg_to_bike

Why not recessed lighting in the ceiling? My parent's house has a very high ceiling in thier family room with recessed lighting. It works well and lights up the entire room. The installation is fairly simple... assuming you have a electrical box up there.

I COULD do recessed lights up there. I already have a ceiling fan.

But how in the FAWK would I ever change teh bulbs? What a PITA.

[chef chris]

Well scrib, I think I'd run the juice from the box on the red wall, up along the stud. Hook my track on the wall at the same heighth as the bump-out on the two outside walls.

This way, you can run the juice, the switch and only cut one verticle line into the sheetrock.

Seems the quickest & easiest without fishing tape, etc.

[chef chris]

Of course, building a soffit to mimmick the other two on the outside walls and hiding everything in there is still viable...would look pretty damn good too, IMHO.

[SDCGTSX]

Forget about doing it outside the drywall. Just get an electrician to do it. I'd guess about $250-$300 since it's pretty high up. It costs me about $140 to hook up a ceiling fan box for a normal 8 ft ceiling with existing switch at the wall.

They basically punch holes in the wall all along the path they want to take and drill a little hole through the wood for the wire to go through. There's regulation for a 10 gauge wire housed in that thick yellow insulation. This theoretically requires a permit and inspection since it'll burn your house down if done incorrectly. It shouldn't matter that you have insulation in the walls. I've seen the electricians just work around it.

You find a switch you want to use, or maybe expand or add a switch to an existing. Then you screw in the box to the ceiling beams and voila! You're set electrically anyhow. Now you've got to do drywall repairs. You guy a sheet of drywall and make sure you cut out the holes in perfect 6" x 6" squares to make it easy on yourself when you patch it back. Get some of that mesh screen that you can apply some plaster over and sand down. The hard part is if you have texture. You've got to sand it down good and then shoot texture over this.

It's pretty involved if you want it to look good. You don't want to make it look cheap with exposed wiring.

[SDCGTSX]

Honestly, I'd personally look into either:

1. 2 Halogen lights.

2. Taking wiring down from the upper floor. The downside to this is that the switch would be upstairs and you may have to go through the floor. Most homes nowadays have lightweight concrete over plywood so you have to dig a bit and fix up. But you can get around this by wiring it to an always on source and just using a remote to control it.

I think option 2 might be cheaper than going through the drywall since drywall work isn't cheap.

[teg_to_bike]

Originally Posted by Scrib

I COULD do recessed lights up there. I already have a ceiling fan.

But how in the FAWK would I ever change teh bulbs? What a PITA.

Most hardware stores sell a bulb changing kit which includes a pole and an attachment that fits around the bulb to allow you to screw/unscrew it w/o a ladder. I doubt the pole is long enough for your room, but i'm sure you can get an extension.

The recessed lighting is the cleanest option and should be the easiest too. I wouldn't attempt installing them in the summer though... your attic must be 110+ degrees!

[GreenMonster]

Originally Posted by SDCGTSX

Forget about doing it outside the drywall. Just get an electrician to do it. I'd guess about $250-$300 since it's pretty high up.

For the cleanest installation, paying a pro would be the best route to go...

EDIT: Might be a good idea to get an estimate from a local electrican to see how much it'll cost. Your might be pleasantly suprised at the price, and if not, you can explore other options.

[Scottman111]

I don't know if an electrician will do it for that cheap. I charge $80 to install a plug

Theres a lot of different ways you can do this. if you have an attic it can be a lot easier.

You can use the switched outlets to turn on your track lights, since all you would have to do is get a wire from one of these outlets to your track lights (since you already have a wire going to your switch) I would probably do this if you hired me.

If you want to use the attic, you can drop a wire overhead down the wall to where it comes out on the plant ledge, then drop the other end down to a switch in that room (and add a stack switch if you want to).

Theres a couple different things you can do with the fan (if you can get to it of course), just ask me and I'll tell you some of your options.

As far as adding recessed lights, they can be a pain in the ass but it's definintely possible. You have a lot of different options for these, too.

If you do hire somebody to do it I would recommend the electrician that wired your house the first time. Everybody does electric there own way, so he would know exactly how he has it wired and probably do it cheaper and easier because of this But if I were you I would do it myself, it's really not that hard.

If you need any help don't hesitate to ask (if you can't already tell I'm an electrician )

[Scrib]

Want to take a nice drive up north???