PC question, XP or Vista . . .? - Page 2

**synth19** · 02-01-2007, 1:39 PM

how's photoshop or any other graphics programs on vista?

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**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 1:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by synth19

how's photoshop or any other graphics programs on vista?

Photoshop works great for me. My girlfriend does a lot of Adobe Illustrator work on the machine with no complaints.

Paint .NET 3 just came out, which does 99% of what I need though.

Billiam · 02-01-2007, 1:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by srika

that is pathetic.

That's just my experience on one model of machine. Ken's obviously differed. Note the tweaking he said he did though. I haven't turned off any services or otherwise tweaked anything. I may be much happier once I have time to sit down and trim the fat.

whynot · 02-01-2007, 1:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken1997TL

For the record:

On my Vista machine, I do everything from burning DVD's to playing games like WoW, Medieval Total War 2. I browse online, do Bittorrents, play movies and do a lot of Office applications. It runs just as fast as XP in almost every case. Bittorrents DO run better on Vista IMO

So just as fast but not any faster? Are you using a dual core or single core processor?

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 1:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billiam

That's just my experience on one model of machine. Ken's obviously differed. Note the tweaking he said he did though. I haven't turned off any services or otherwise tweaked anything. I may be much happier once I have time to sit down and trim the fat.

It felt like an unfinished beta before I did all the trimming.

services.msc > *

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 1:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whynot

So just as fast but not any faster? Are you using a dual core or single core processor?

Dual Core AMD x2

Just as fast.

IMO networking is improved though.

**fuzzy02CLS** · 02-01-2007, 1:45 PM

I haven't touched it, but from what I hear & read it's an OS that has a lot of added fluff to make it friendly & easy to use for most of the world. I agree it should have been XP service pack 3.

However I can see it being very annoying for people that know what they are doing on a PC.

My biggest fear is the hidden stuff in it. As it's geared for security & all that, how it's going to react to porn sites, PayPal, anything that requires encryption.
Also will Firefox work on it fine? Will I be able to avoid MS apps & use others, or will Vista force me to use certain features I don't want?
Will I be able to burn my DVD's & CD's using my software?
I'm about speed, all this fluff is bound to slow it down.
You kidding me? 4 gigs of memory to run vista? even 2 gigs? That's nuts!!!!! Trim that bitch down!

Billiam · 02-01-2007, 1:47 PM

BTW, I do have to second a compliment Ken made. I don't know if it's the improved IP stack or what but the networking performance definitely feels faster. I have no idea if it would ever be noticeable surfing your average site from home, but I definitely noticed it here at work where I have good chunk of bandwidth at my disposal.

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 1:48 PM

1) Umm I run it just fine with 1 gig of RAM.

2) The fluff can be easily shut off.

3) I've had NO problems running Firefox 2

4) I've burned a lot of DVD's and CD's

5) My understanding is that HD-DVD's are the only real issue that Vista has with DRM

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 1:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billiam

BTW, I do have to second a compliment Ken made. I don't know if it's the improved IP stack or what but the networking performance definitely feels faster. I have no idea if it would ever be noticeable surfing your average site from home, but I definitely noticed it here at work where I have good chunk of bandwidth at my disposal.

Yeah, I dont think the average user would notice.

But you crazy mofos and your pr0n bittorrents WILL notice, especially if you have an 8+ MB cable or fiber connection

**srika** · 02-01-2007, 1:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken1997TL

For the record:

On my Vista machine, I do everything from burning DVD's to playing games like WoW, Medieval Total War 2. I browse online, do Bittorrents, play movies and do a lot of Office applications. It runs just as fast as XP in almost every case. Bittorrents DO run better on Vista IMO

You've probably already told us somewhere but what are the specs on your pc? Just out of curiosity.

**srika** · 02-01-2007, 1:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by srika

You've probably already told us somewhere but what are the specs on your pc? Just out of curiosity.

edit: saw the end of pg2... I wonder if Vista likes AMD better

ok seriously though its good to hear some positives about Vista and its also good that you can turn all the bloatware off. Seeing how its the only option at most sites now, I guess there really is no other choice, unless of course you buy your pc, format, and install XP. :P

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 1:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by srika

You've probably already told us somewhere but what are the specs on your pc? Just out of curiosity.

AMD x2 3800+
1 gig of RAM
ATI Radeon x1600XT

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 1:56 PM

Perhaps I can do a tweak guide for Vista.

My best guess is that my tweaks would take about 20 minutes and its mostly just fiddling around with the services.

whynot · 02-01-2007, 2:00 PM

Tell us which services you shut down

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 2:01 PM

http://www.errorforum.com/microsoft-...de-v1-0-a.html

This guide will have to do until I get home.

Billiam · 02-01-2007, 2:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken1997TL

Perhaps I can do a tweak guide for Vista.

If you do it, be sure you note which edition you're working with. I would assume that Business & Ultimate have several additional services than either of the two Home editions.

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 2:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billiam

If you do it, be sure you note which edition you're working with. I would assume that Business & Ultimate have several additional services than either of the two Home editions.

Oh they do for sure. I'm running Ultimate for the record.

JediMindTricks · 02-01-2007, 2:10 PM

i'll update to vista...i just don't know when.

i bought a new laptop last month, and i was eligible for a free copy of vista. so hopefully i'll get one soon. who knows how long.

i don't really do any gaming either.

studville · 02-01-2007, 2:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken1997TL

For the record:

On my Vista machine, I do everything from burning DVD's to playing games like WoW, Medieval Total War 2. I browse online, do Bittorrents, play movies and do a lot of Office applications. It runs just as fast as XP in almost every case. Bittorrents DO run better on Vista IMO

Same here, but it's slower on my machine... granted I'm on a lappy with only 1 gig RAM. But I'll take the temporary added feeling of security for the laggy speed (WITHOUT having to learn a new operating system -- linux/MacOS/FreeBSD etc etc).

Any one try the ReadyBoost and care to comment?

alex2364 · 02-01-2007, 2:19 PM

Anyone know if Nero 6 will work on Vista? I tried searching but haven't found anything definite.

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 2:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alex2364

Anyone know if Nero 6 will work on Vista? I tried searching but haven't found anything definite.

It does.

**SiGGy** · 02-01-2007, 2:38 PM

I posted a review done professionally on gaming in vista. I love what Ken has to say, but he probably hasn't actually benchmarked anything. He's going by the seat of his pants.

The O/S is seriously lacking right now... All of the benchmarks show it. And video drivers are way behind, as with most of Vista drivers.

If you aren't a die hard windows user you probably won't notice it. But if you play FPS shooter games and or use any major CPU intensive apps I'd hold off. Go and read the review I posted. I even quoted the article... Google for Vista benchmarks you'll find plenty of them...

I don't have time to beta test stuff for Microsoft... maybe some of you do. But I certainly won't pay to do it...

Again, if your just surfing the web and buring CDs, listening to MP3s/movies... go for it...

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 2:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SiGGy

I posted a review done professionally on gaming in vista. I love what Ken has to say, but he probably hasn't actually benchmarked anything. He's going by the seat of his pants.

True. If Vista is slower on games than XP, I dont notice it.

http://www.gamespot.com/features/616...;picks;title;4

There are Vista vs XP benchmarks here for games

whynot · 02-01-2007, 2:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SiGGy

I posted a review done professionally on gaming in vista. I love what Ken has to say, but he probably hasn't actually benchmarked anything. He's going by the seat of his pants.

The O/S is seriously lacking right now... All of the benchmarks show it. And video drivers are way behind, as with most of Vista drivers.

If you aren't a die hard windows user you probably won't notice it. But if you play FPS shooter games and or use any major CPU intensive apps I'd hold off. Go and read the review I posted. I even quoted the article... Google for Vista benchmarks you'll find plenty of them...

I don't have time to beta test stuff for Microsoft... maybe some of you do. But I certainly won't pay to do it...

Again, if your just surfing the web and buring CDs, listening to MP3s/movies... go for it...

I agree with most of this but you don't necessarily have to give up one for the other, just partition your drive install both OS's on it and with this dual-boot setup you'll be able to experience the best of both worlds.

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 2:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whynot

I agree with most of this but you don't necessarily have to give up one for the other, just partition your drive install both OS's on it and with this dual-boot setup you'll be able to experience the best of both worlds.

Bingo.

jupitersolo · 02-01-2007, 2:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SiGGy

If you aren't a die hard windows user you probably won't notice it. But if you play FPS shooter games and or use any major CPU intensive apps I'd hold off. Go and read the review I posted. I even quoted the article... Google for Vista benchmarks you'll find plenty of them...

From the article that you linked the guys final conclusion were that bad. And it looks like he was using a balls to the wall system. One that gamers would buy.

Quote:

Final Thoughts

It may seem like my testing with gaming performance in Vista all resulted in a feeling of doom (nope, no OpenGL support!) and gloom, but don't let that scare you off just yet. I think we all expected there to be some initial growing pains with the Vista operating system and PC gaming simply because of the dramatic shift in driver technology that had to take place; I just don't think we expected it to be this bad. AMD's driver development team is definitely a leap ahead of NVIDIA's as the initial release ATI Catalyst driver offered a gaming experience much closer to that of Windows XP in the new Vista OS than NVIDIA's initial Forceware release. This may change as driver revisions are updated through the comings months, so we'll definitely be keeping an eye on both companies progress.

For now, gamers that were interested in running off to get a copy of Windows Vista, I'd caution you to take a minute and contemplate. Gaming under Vista is definitely possible and if you're comfortable with some slight performance drops for now while taking advantage of Vista's other new features, then a move to Vista sooner rather than later should be considered. If gaming and gaming performance is your only metric for your PC, then I'd definitely hold out on upgrading until AMD and NVIDIA have their software perfected.

**SiGGy** · 02-01-2007, 2:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jupitersolo

From the article that you linked the guys final conclusion were that bad. And it looks like he was using a balls to the wall system. One that gamers would buy.

ya, he said he would tell any gamer to think twice about running out and installing it because gamer performance isn't there yet. In fact he recommends AGAINST it.

As I said, Video drivers aren't there yet... Nvidia is way behind for Vista. Lots of manufacturers aren't ready for Vista yet. Their XP stuff is much better.

In 6-9 months most of these issues will be gone... and Vista should be better than XP. I hope so anyway... lol

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 2:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SiGGy

ya, he said he would tell any gamer to think twice about running out and installing it because gamer performance isn't there yet. In fact he recommends AGAINST it.

As I said, Video drivers aren't there yet... Nvidia is way behind for Vista. Lots of manufacturers aren't ready for Vista yet. Their XP stuff is much better.

Yeah, Nvidia is really behind. The ATI drivers (surprisingly) are quite good.

jupitersolo · 02-01-2007, 3:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SiGGy

ya, he said he would tell any gamer to think twice about running out and installing it because gamer performance isn't there yet. In fact he recommends AGAINST it.

As I said, Video drivers aren't there yet... Nvidia is way behind for Vista. Lots of manufacturers aren't ready for Vista yet. Their XP stuff is much better.

In 6-9 months most of these issues will be gone... and Vista should be better than XP. I hope so anyway... lol

I'm just thinking about Dan original question. He didn't go into it, but I don't think he was buying a gaming system. And a new system with Vista wouldn't be so bad.

whynot · 02-01-2007, 3:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken1997TL

Yeah, Nvidia is really behind. The ATI drivers (surprisingly) are quite good.

That's kinda ironic since ATI doesn't even have a video card out that supports DX10... but yeah I've stuck with ATI cards for over 5 years and I'm not about to switch... Nvidia is simply inferior

jupitersolo · 02-01-2007, 3:16 PM

Looking at this a little more, nvidia have their hands full on their own website.

http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showforum=24

**Ken1997TL** · 02-01-2007, 3:17 PM

http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=26810

A Fully functional Vista Driver will be available by 2400 hrs PST 02/01/07 or the bear will die. Make your choice.

**fsttyms1** · 02-01-2007, 3:26 PM

jupitersolo · 02-01-2007, 3:29 PM

Please BEAR with us as we make the necessary changes.

studville · 02-01-2007, 3:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jupitersolo

Please BEAR with us as we make the necessary changes.

3/10

jupitersolo · 02-01-2007, 3:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by studville

3/10

I was thinking about George (from Seinfeld) when he was asking the guy to get his car out of the hooker lot.

jupitersolo · 02-01-2007, 3:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken1997TL

I have it. I like it, it was free courtesy of MSDN. I wouldnt buy it though until I had to. It runs just as fast as XP in most cases. Networking seems to be better than XP's. Gaming? No difference that I can see. I DID have to tweak with Vista a lot, though. I basically had to shut off a lot of WORTHLESS services that are on by default. It feels unfinished and quite frankly, should have been XP's Service Pack 3.

Stick with XP Pro

http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-3513_7-...ml?tag=slide_1

whynot · 02-01-2007, 8:02 PM

take THAT, Apple

http://youtube.com/watch?v=oiG7KFDYkLI

fla-tls · 02-01-2007, 8:23 PM

Wow - after disabling all of those services to "tweak" it....

What's the difference between Vista and XP? You've spent money on an upgrade and then disabled all of the new features that you paid for to make the upgrade worthwhile???

I don't get it.

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02-01-2007, 1:45 PM	#47
fuzzy02CLS Moderator Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: South FL Age: 34 Posts: 14,024	I haven't touched it, but from what I hear & read it's an OS that has a lot of added fluff to make it friendly & easy to use for most of the world. I agree it should have been XP service pack 3. However I can see it being very annoying for people that know what they are doing on a PC. My biggest fear is the hidden stuff in it. As it's geared for security & all that, how it's going to react to porn sites, PayPal, anything that requires encryption. Also will Firefox work on it fine? Will I be able to avoid MS apps & use others, or will Vista force me to use certain features I don't want? Will I be able to burn my DVD's & CD's using my software? I'm about speed, all this fluff is bound to slow it down. You kidding me? 4 gigs of memory to run vista? even 2 gigs? That's nuts!!!!! Trim that bitch down!

02-01-2007, 1:47 PM	#48
Billiam Big Block go VROOOM! Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Chicago Burbs Age: 39 Posts: 8,470	BTW, I do have to second a compliment Ken made. I don't know if it's the improved IP stack or what but the networking performance definitely feels faster. I have no idea if it would ever be noticeable surfing your average site from home, but I definitely noticed it here at work where I have good chunk of bandwidth at my disposal.

02-01-2007, 1:48 PM	#49
Ken1997TL Mega Moderator 2002 Acura RL Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Everywhere and nowhere Posts: 31,736	1) Umm I run it just fine with 1 gig of RAM. 2) The fluff can be easily shut off. 3) I've had NO problems running Firefox 2 4) I've burned a lot of DVD's and CD's 5) My understanding is that HD-DVD's are the only real issue that Vista has with DRM

02-01-2007, 1:56 PM	#54
Ken1997TL Mega Moderator 2002 Acura RL Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Everywhere and nowhere Posts: 31,736	Perhaps I can do a tweak guide for Vista. My best guess is that my tweaks would take about 20 minutes and its mostly just fiddling around with the services.

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whynot X spots the mark Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Concrete jungles Age: 28 Posts: 1,512	Tell us which services you shut down

02-01-2007, 2:01 PM	#56
Ken1997TL Mega Moderator 2002 Acura RL Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Everywhere and nowhere Posts: 31,736	http://www.errorforum.com/microsoft-...de-v1-0-a.html This guide will have to do until I get home.

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JediMindTricks What Would Don Draper Do? Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Houston Age: 30 Posts: 22,169	i'll update to vista...i just don't know when. i bought a new laptop last month, and i was eligible for a free copy of vista. so hopefully i'll get one soon. who knows how long. i don't really do any gaming either.

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02-01-2007, 2:38 PM	#63
SiGGy Mega Moderator Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Lenexa, KS Age: 33 Posts: 9,274	I posted a review done professionally on gaming in vista. I love what Ken has to say, but he probably hasn't actually benchmarked anything. He's going by the seat of his pants. The O/S is seriously lacking right now... All of the benchmarks show it. And video drivers are way behind, as with most of Vista drivers. If you aren't a die hard windows user you probably won't notice it. But if you play FPS shooter games and or use any major CPU intensive apps I'd hold off. Go and read the review I posted. I even quoted the article... Google for Vista benchmarks you'll find plenty of them... I don't have time to beta test stuff for Microsoft... maybe some of you do. But I certainly won't pay to do it... Again, if your just surfing the web and buring CDs, listening to MP3s/movies... go for it...

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Ken1997TL Mega Moderator 2002 Acura RL Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Everywhere and nowhere Posts: 31,736	http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=26810 A Fully functional Vista Driver will be available by 2400 hrs PST 02/01/07 or the bear will die. Make your choice.

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02-01-2007, 3:29 PM	#75
jupitersolo cameras R my crack Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Fairfax, Va. Age: 45 Posts: 19,571	Please BEAR with us as we make the necessary changes.

02-01-2007, 8:23 PM	#80
fla-tls On the way! Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Orlando, FL Age: 41 Posts: 3,636	Wow - after disabling all of those services to "tweak" it.... What's the difference between Vista and XP? You've spent money on an upgrade and then disabled all of the new features that you paid for to make the upgrade worthwhile??? I don't get it.