elduderino

This is to explain how to make mating spacers for speakers for the doors.

The purpose of mating spacers is to mate up to the rear of the door panel, the way the factory speaker frame does. This allows the whole door panel to be the speaker's "baffle".

A baffle is the panel a speaker is mounted to. The more a baffle leaks, or the smaller it is, the less mid-bass can be played. The metal skin inside the door is very leaky, and many people respond to this by sealing up all the holes with a big sheet of Dynamat. This makes the speaker sound better, but also covers up all the bolts needed by mechanics if anything ever breaks or you get hit. Also, it adds more weight than you need to add.

The mating-spacer solution sounds better because the speaker is firing directly through the door panel hole into the cabin, instead of into a chamber with a hole in it (the chamber is the space between the door panel and the door). Much higher-fidelity sound is possible this way.

NOTE: Before you start, take your window switch, plug it in, and roll the window UP, and then unplug it again and put it away again.

Tools and materials needed from Home Depot:

Jigsaw
Drill

1 2x2 sheet of 3/4" inch birch plywood (may need 1/2" instead based on your speakers - read on)
1 2x2 sheet of 1/4" tempered masonite
1 2x2 sheet of 1/8" tempered masonite (may be optional - read on)

1 can flat black
1-1-2" Pan Head #8 Phillips sheet metal screws
1/2" Pan Head #8 Phillips Sheet metal screws
Set of drill bits (NOT a unibit!)

Adhesive foam tape, 1/4" (in weatherstripping section)

Tape measure and pencil

Acura speaker adapter harnesses from Autotoys - because the speaker wire is too damned short.

Here is the speaker I used:



As later photos will show, it is very deep. Some questioned the use of the 5.25 instead of the 6.5, but this technique is equally effective for 6.5's, as long as they clear.


The factory speaker is 1-1/8" thick. The front of this speaker frame - the mounting tabs and the outer edge of the frame - is just under 1/4" thick.

So I made a spacer out of the 3/4", just a bit larger in OD than the speaker itself, and I made a trim ring out of the 1/4" material. I planned on the 1/4" foam tape taking up the last 1/8" after compression of the foam (and I was right).

I traced the interior hole using the plastic spacer ring supplied in the box. The exterior hole I also used the spacer that came in the box, but only because it was about the same OD as the factory speaker. I could've used the factory speaker too.





As these pics show, the 1/4" material "flushes" the edge of the frame. The surround does not stick forward as much as this first pic makes it seem to, but even if it did, it wouldn't be hitting anything.

If you are using speakers that have thinner magnets, but have thicker stamped-frame fronts (like most coaxials), you may need to use a 1/2" spacer and then stack some 1/4" or combine some 1/4" and 1/8" spacer rings and trim rings to make everything come out right. This part is trial and error. Fortunately, the errors are cheap (the wood, that is). You may also want to use foam tape on the front of your trim ring - I did not need to on mine.

NOTE: If you are using hefty 6.5"s, your outer diameter on the ring and your inner diameter on your speaker hole will get very close - that is, your ring thickness/cross-section will get very thin. This makes the ring easy to break - I shattered joercket's first one because I did NOT drill out pilot holes in the spacers! Granted, that one was made of particleboard, which is why I've switched to birch high-grade plywood, but still... So if using the big guns, be careful with your jigsaw, drill pilot holes, and you should be fine.







Here are the factory speaker and my spacer stack side by side on a flat surface. Gives you a good look at the frame thickness and the magnet depth.

Once you know it's going to work, spray-paint it black with a few coats, for both visual and moisture-protective purposes.

NOTE: For you rookies, do this away from your and any other cars! : )



Here is the speaker opening in the door. It's not round, btw. Apply the foam tape to the door as shown (shorter pieces work best).



Then take some masking tape and tape your spacer-ring stack to the back of your door panel, over the speaker hole, and make sure you can snap it back into place. If you can't, trimming or re-designing is needed. If you can, go to the next step.

Hold the stack up to the hole. Mark where your screws will mount the ring to the door. Mark them on the ring.

NOTE: Make sure that you miss all the little square holes in the metal that are for the speaker snap-in tabs!

Select a drill bit large enough to allow your screws to go through without grabbing the wood (sorry, I forgot the size...). Predrill the rings out of the car. Then use a smaller bit and predrill the holes in the metal of the door.

BEFORE mounting the ring to the car, re-assemble the speaker into the spacer stack and mark the mounting tab holes. Then, using as small a bit as you can that you think will work, predrill the speaker mounting holes.

NOTE: If you use the same drill bit that you use for the mounting ring holes, your screws will strip out! Conversely, if you use this drill bit for the mounting ring pilot holes, you may break your ring when you screw it into the door, because the screw threads will be grabbing the wood too much on the way through...

If your speaker comes with its own foam tape (these did) apply it to the back of the speaker frame now.

Now mount the ring to the metal.

NOTE: Before mounting the speaker to the ring, connect the speaker wires! I used the speaker wire harnesses because the door wires were so short:



Then mount the speaker:





Now put your door panel back on. If it doesn't go on, get out the file and work the front lower corner. If that doesn't work, re-think.

acuratsx03

damn, i wish i could do that. definitley not as skilled, nor do i have the tools. so its come down to Sound Advice. ive just decided im gonna bring my audio jobs there. theyll install the type r woofers in the F doors and add the xovers that i need badly. also i think im gonna get replace the stock amp and buy an Alpine MRV-F340 to power the components and the 6x9s. im also gonna have them build me a custom box with amp racks and such... its gonna cost around 600 i bet, but if im gonna do it, i might as well do it right. more power to those like you that do it yourself

elduderino

Well, I'm not exactly a rookie at this - do not try this at home! : )

I would talk to the install manager before starting... Sound Advice used to have a pretty good reputation, but ALL chain stores have sloppy QC on their installs at times, varying by staff and management. Print out the pics and show them what you want.

I would put the xovers in the c/c at the factory amp location, or under the carpet on the pass side against the firewall.

I would also print out the wire diagrams from the thread here that has the amp pinouts (not remembering off the top of my head what that was) because they probably won't have that info... in fact, print out the threads for door removal, amp wiring, and center console disassembly.

Good luck!

acuratsx03

ill be sure to do all of that before i go, thanks for the great advice. i talked to the guy and turns out someone with a TSX just went there to get some speakers installed so hell know about the door removal and made a pattern for the spacers needed. but ill def. print out all the amp infor i can find. this friday im gonna take it to make an appointment, so hopefully itll all turn out well

elduderino

1 other piece of advice: I did a search for Plantation FL on the Alpine web site for F#1 dealers, and I got quite a few in the area. You might want to consider some of them... I don't know geography well enough to know who's close, but single-store operations are capable of better installs than chains, as a general rule.

acuratsx03

wow, you rock! im def. gonna check out one of the locations, its only 9 miles away. gonna get some price estimates and stuff like that. and as for the mrv-f340 amp, im thinking of going the way of ebay, seeing as i could get it ~$150 less than store price. i bought all my other audio equipment from there and i havent had any problems yet... im jsut trying to save some money here. relating to that, do you think the mrp-f240 amp would be enough to power the type r components and type s 6x9s or should i go with the mrv-f340... for all the installation, custom box and parts im setting my budget at $600, so ebay is a bit enticing, but im not sure yet, still need to think it through... thanks for the help once again

p.s.
sorry for hijacking the thread...

elduderino

hehe... tks... even if the 2 amps were the same power, the much better xover in the 340 should earn it the nod.

BTW, if you bring your own gear, often shops charge a little more. Some shops won't work with wal;k-in gear, so make sure before you start. Be kinda apologetic, and give them the chance to price match WITHOUT being demanding - they may give you the same price IF you are paying for a nice install job...

acuratsx03

ill be sure to do my homework before i throw down my hard earned cash... the guy at sound advice even told me hed work out a price for the amp, so hopefully ill be able to keep within my budget...

EDIT: maybe not, $400 amp alone, plus the estimated $400 for the box and speaker installs.... oh well, i got myself into it, i can work my self out...

elduderino

If you have a sub in the trunk, consider a 2-channel amp and mids and highs up front instead.

Of course, everyone must know how I feel about by-nines by now : )

musicbox

Oh Oh! You need to add my rain water protection techinque . I'll have to get some pics when I do my TSX. In my last 2 cars, I bought some PETG (the same stuff used for blister packing formed by vacuum molding). And I made some killer water protection. It takes a little time to get the whole technique down, and you have to make a couple jigs, but the PETG only costs about $20 for 4x8 sheet, so not like your out anything but time.

I can't find any pics, my buddy did it in his vette, too, I can't find those pics either...

elduderino

Dammit! I am so used to putting in poly-cone speaks that I never thought about it. These Scan-made Alpines are paper, sure as anything.

I've made water shields before... now I'll have to go in there again. Damn.

BallsOfSteel

Hey Elduderino,

Did you get a chance to make water shields for your fronts?

elduderino

I did, but I didn't take it. Instead I replaced these with DLS UP6s. Writing a review soon.

BTW, I would use a 6.75" OD for the spacer - a point I forgot to mention.

StreetEffectz

Did you say "jigsaw" for cutting circles? LOL, I'm just playin' !

elduderino

I made them with a jigsaw in the basement originally, but the shop has a router table : )

BallsOfSteel

Why would you use a 6.75" OD for the spacer? Is there a flaw in the spacers you made?

elduderino

OD means Outside Diameter, sorry. I never specified measurements in the original post. For the ID just use the spacer in the speaekr box : )

optomos

Hey eld, is this something I should do with the Seas lotus in my car? Also can you elaborate on this -->"and make sure you can snap it back into place"<--

BTW nice post

elduderino

Thanks... I would use a router today, with a shop and all...

I don't know which mid Seas is using, do they have a web page with the diagram? And did you get 5s or 6s?

If the ring is too wide in outside diameter or the combo of speaker-spacer stack is over 1-1/8 inch of height under the speaker grille, the door panel might not snap back on. You want the same height as the OEM speaker so the ring on the back of the door panel snugs up against the face of the speaker-spacer stack. Better midbass that way.

optomos

The 6.5. Im ordering it this thirsday. Here are the specs:

Contents:
2 x RW165. 165mm High End
Automotive Woofers.
2 x RT25A / F. 25mm High End
Automotive Tweeters.
2 x RX1,7H High Pass Crossover.
2 x RX1,7L Low Pass Crossover.
2 x Lengths of Special O.F.C Tweeter Cable.
1 Pair of Handling Gloves.
1 Set of Mounting Hardware.

Specs:
Power handling: Max. 250W
Nom. 100W.
Mounting depth: 71.5mm.
Cut out diameter: 145.3mm.
Frequency response: 40-25 000Hz.
Crossover frequency: 1700Hz.
Voice coil: 39mm.
Fs: 48Hz.
QTS: 0.42.
VAS: 15.0 litres

http://www.mobilesq.com/images/produ...lotusref65.gif

What would you charge to make them? Or you dont do that kind of thing.

dchondasport

I did the exact same thing to my 2002 TL-S. The problem was that the speaker opening was too small for my Kicker Resolution 6.5" speakers to fit. I had to cut the plastic tabs around the grille on the door to make clearance (I didn't touch the grill itself) and then make spacers with 2x half-inch MDF pieces that I screwed together. Then I sheet-metal screwed them to the doors. I had to take a hammer to the openings. It bent VERY easily to allow me enough space for the back of teh new speakers. I sealed it all up with clear RTV and it sounds GREAT!

BallsOfSteel

Did you replace your fronts with DLS UP6's yet? Please give us an update.

BallsOfSteel

Tweeter made custom 1 inch wood spacers for the fronts for $25 in about 10 mins. I installed the speakers myself without any modifications. Perfect fit for MB Quarts DKE 116 !!!

elduderino

So I guess that means that you didn't go to Ron's?

BallsOfSteel

I will see what Ron has to offer for installing an amp and subs. I can install the basic stuff but amps and subs are out of my league.

optomos

I went to tweeter (aka High fi buys) and left one of my speakers friday at lunch. They said they would call me when it was done. No call, so I go back & they said its not done yet. So I just left it with them over the weekend and told them I would pick it up on monday.

I go back today and the guy goes back to the shop. So im waiting & waiting.....(never a good sign) Guy comes back and says "he didnt finish them, but we have two plastic 1/2 spacers you could use & they would look better then the wood ones we would of made" I said "Like I said when I brought them in, they have to be 6.75 O.Djust let me have my speaker back!" What a bunch of asses. Its no wonder they are closing alot their stores down....Their QOS blows.

elduderino

Gosh, I'm surprised : )

The total stack thickness is 1-1/8th.

If you want we can make some for ya...

optomos

Would you need one of the speakers?

elduderino

Not if you can give me the thickness of the frame mounting ring surface and the OD of the frame at its widest point just below the mounting ring surface : )

Is there a SEAS datasheet with that info?

optomos

here

elduderino

Well, I can definitely make a spacer ring with this info, thanks.

Only thing is, before I do that, you need to check and see if you can fit that speaker 1.8" into the hole in the sheet metal.

Basically, that speaker needs to go into the hole with 3/4" to 7/8" between the back of the frame and the front of the door metal. The rest of the 1-1/8" is going to be taken up with the frame thickness and maybe the outer edge of the surround bulge.

If that doesn't fit, you are gonna need to either remove some metal, or mod the back of the door panel, no matter what I do with the spacer ring.

optomos

So you think there might be a width/depth issue? The speaker is 3" deep & 5 1/2" wide underneath the mounting face.

elduderino

The deal is the the hole in the metal is not round... so the question becomes how the spokes fit in the hole with 3/4" of the depth protruding.

Only way to know for sure is to take off a door panel. I recommend pulling the pass door panel with the instructions in the master DIY thread.

optomos

ic, ok ill do that & back to you. So I should center the speaker in the "center" of the hole to test right?

optomos

Looks like I will have to trim some metal off. Here are the pics:

Right here its sticking out 1 1/2"











4/16 difference from the top of both lips. The Bose measured 1" from bottom of plastice spacer to the top lip of the metal

elduderino

Nice pics, thanks.

As we used to say at Ultimate-um Autosound (where price was no object): "It's only metal - they make cars out of it every day".

Unfortunately, the best tools to do that with are run off of a BIG air compressor and are kinda hard to find.

Do you have a CL-S? That looks like a CL-S speaker... I'll buy those spacers off of you : )

You didn't add in the foam tape on the back of the spacer ring and the foam on the back of the door panel : )

OK, once you have the holes cut out the manner in which you fasten the spacers to the doors is no longer a big deal, so I'll give you some predrilled spacers that actually screw to the door first and then the speaker screws to that.
Then what I would do if I were you is have a top ring that goes on top of the frame and flushes the surround bump (is as tall as the bump).

Then that's what the back of the door panel hits and seals against.

You might be able to use the included grille ring for that - did you ahve any spacer or grille rings that came with the kit?

optomos

1. I have a 99 TL
2. ok?
3.
4. The kit didnt come with any.

elduderino

Well, rats.

What we do with our other kits is make a 1/8" (3mm) abs plastic spacer ring on the router. The ID of the hole is just larger than the surround bump circumference, and the outer edge is the outer edge of the speaker spacer ring. In your case I am guessing that this ring would have to be pretty darned narrow - about 7.5mm wide in fact, based on that drawing's dimensions. 146mm ID and 171mm OD.

So if the spacer stack has to take up about 24-25mm, and 8mm is taken up by the frame thickness and the surround bump height, you have 17-18 mm to go. 18mm is 3/4", so you're just about right.

optomos

LOL, ok ill take your word for it. Now for for someting I hope I can comprehend....How much? Let me know if you still want those things.