Lexus should bring in Chaser and get rid of ES300

SilverCL225hp · 07-23-2002, 3:44 AM

Well I think the front -wheel-drive ES300 is not suitable for Lexus anymore, although it is the best selling model in Lexus lineup. In order to make all Lexus sedans consistent, Toyota Chaser(or Mark II) is more appropriate in my opinion, and Lexus can call it a RS300 or something. The current generation of ES300 just make me puke, and it's still not much different from Camry mechanical-wise, when Camry looks way better than it. Think of this lineup:
LS430(Celsior), GS430/GS300(Aristo), RS300(Chaser), IS300(Altezza). All RWD powers.
And then Toyota has the following FWD powers:
Avalon, Camry V6, Camry I4, Corolla, Echo.

By the way, is Lexus going to bring in a LS500, which is rumored to debut in the soon future in Japan?

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KavexTrax · 07-23-2002, 4:07 AM

I think I sense a new GS model coming soon by the end of this year or early next year.

There's been a sudden barrage of GS commercials lately, both new and old. It's due for a new design.

IntegraVT · 07-23-2002, 7:35 AM

I agree that the ES gets lost in Toyota's muddled lineup.

However the ES300 isn't going anywhere. Not only does it account for half of all Lexi (Lexuses?) sold period, but YTD sales are up 89% over last year.

Toyota has the resources and raw sales numbers to divide and conquer each market segment as they see fit. Going mainstream for bulk (Camry) then attacking the fringes (Avalon/IS/ES/GS300.)

Dom418 · 07-23-2002, 8:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SilverCL225hp
Well I think the front -wheel-drive ES300 is not suitable for Lexus anymore, although it is the best selling model in Lexus lineup. In order to make all Lexus sedans consistent, Toyota Chaser(or Mark II) is more appropriate in my opinion, and Lexus can call it a RS300 or something. The current generation of ES300 just make me puke, and it's still not much different from Camry mechanical-wise, when Camry looks way better than it. Think of this lineup:
LS430(Celsior), GS430/GS300(Aristo), RS300(Chaser), IS300(Altezza). All RWD powers.
And then Toyota has the following FWD powers:
Avalon, Camry V6, Camry I4, Corolla, Echo.

By the way, is Lexus going to bring in a LS500, which is rumored to debut in the soon future in Japan?

Any pics of one??

ThoroDredCLS · 07-23-2002, 8:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dom418

Any pics of one??

I am also curious to see what that looks like.

IntegraVT · 07-23-2002, 9:30 AM

Mark II -

Dom418 · 07-23-2002, 9:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by IntegraVT
Mark II -

Looks like a Benz C-Class to me ???

Black CL-S 4-Life · 07-23-2002, 9:44 AM

I've always wanted to know what the Toms Chaser was ever since I won one on Gran Turismo 3.

StanMan · 07-23-2002, 12:13 PM

isn't the windom the equivalent to the es300? i know it was for the last gen. the chaser kinda looked more like the last gen of camry's. mark II is kinda corolla-ish, especially the headlights.

jts1207 · 07-23-2002, 12:15 PM

what is it...........a rear wheel drive camry

IntegraVT · 07-23-2002, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jts1207
what is it...........a rear wheel drive camry

RWD 2.5L I6 turbo, 280hp, 278lbft.

JagV12 · 07-23-2002, 12:57 PM

It looks like the I35, Q45 and LS430 had a threesome!!

Tom2 · 07-23-2002, 1:11 PM

I thought that the RX300 was the best selling Lexus??

Tom2 · 07-23-2002, 1:15 PM

Nevermind.... I found the info.

Here's a quote from autonews.com:

Quote:

.....The Lexus luxury total was pulled down by the RX 300, its best-selling vehicle, and ES 300, its best-selling car.....

shaHn78 · 07-23-2002, 1:55 PM

There's no way they would get rid of or replace the current ES models for 2 very simple reasons:

1 - Like all luxury divisions, the entry level cars, such as the ES are the bread earners of the company. They can either make or break the compant. Thats why so much is riding on cadillac's CTS, STC, TITS whatever the hell its called... too bad its gonna be a bomb. :P

2 - the ES is selling like pancakes... and like someone mentioned its sales are up 89% from last year. So they'd be total NUTS to try to change or replace it.

And about all models being RWD in lexus' stable, i think MOST buyers dont really know the difference so they could careless as long as it rides the way they want. People buy lexus for its overall quality and its smooth luxurious ride more then anything else, and its only ppl who want a bit of SPORT, like us, who get turned off by them.

Many ppl on this board think the ES is just a fancy CAMRY and dont think much of it. Well the same implies for our TL which tries to stay in the shadows of the ACCORD, which really is the reputation earner for honda. Plus the TL & ACCORD share more parts then do CAMRY & ES.

moomaster_99 · 07-23-2002, 2:03 PM

2.5L I6 Turbo....sounds suspiciously like an Altezza...

1SICKLEX · 07-23-2002, 4:44 PM

ES will be a ES 330 in 2 years FYI (along with the GS 330 and RX 330 and SC 330).

THe ES 300 is selling 7k cars a month, proving you don't need to be in a horsepower war to sway buyers. Plus the ES has a following and a brand of a very reliable car.

RX 300 is the best selling luxury SUV, ES 300 will regain the best selling entry level luxury car.

**CLpower** · 07-23-2002, 4:46 PM

they need to bring over a good fun little car. The sc's are cool, but way to fuckin heavy.

1SICKLEX · 07-23-2002, 5:29 PM

n20 junkie gave it away bub....

Well, the MR2 is light enough, not a Lexus but a helluva car.

SilverCL225hp · 07-24-2002, 3:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by shaHn78
There's no way they would get rid of or replace the current ES models for 2 very simple reasons:

1 - Like all luxury divisions, the entry level cars, such as the ES are the bread earners of the company. They can either make or break the compant. Thats why so much is riding on cadillac's CTS, STC, TITS whatever the hell its called... too bad its gonna be a bomb. :P

2 - the ES is selling like pancakes... and like someone mentioned its sales are up 89% from last year. So they'd be total NUTS to try to change or replace it.

And about all models being RWD in lexus' stable, i think MOST buyers dont really know the difference so they could careless as long as it rides the way they want. People buy lexus for its overall quality and its smooth luxurious ride more then anything else, and its only ppl who want a bit of SPORT, like us, who get turned off by them.

Many ppl on this board think the ES is just a fancy CAMRY and dont think much of it. Well the same implies for our TL which tries to stay in the shadows of the ACCORD, which really is the reputation earner for honda. Plus the TL & ACCORD share more parts then do CAMRY & ES.

I totally agree with you and completely understand your points, but still, Chaser seems more like a luxury car to me. But probably it is overlapping with GS300.

07-23-2002, 4:07 AM	#2
KavexTrax Registered Member Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Santa Clarita, CA Posts: 8,390	I think I sense a new GS model coming soon by the end of this year or early next year. There's been a sudden barrage of GS commercials lately, both new and old. It's due for a new design. __________________ • [ A c u r a - C L .c o m FAQ by Chodthewacko ]

07-23-2002, 7:35 AM	#3
IntegraVT Stealthy A-CL Member Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: WNY, NJ Posts: 1,324	I agree that the ES gets lost in Toyota's muddled lineup. However the ES300 isn't going anywhere. Not only does it account for half of all Lexi (Lexuses?) sold period, but YTD sales are up 89% over last year. Toyota has the resources and raw sales numbers to divide and conquer each market segment as they see fit. Going mainstream for bulk (Camry) then attacking the fringes (Avalon/IS/ES/GS300.) __________________ '09 RDX BasqueRedPearl '08 TL NighthawkBlackPearl '06 MDX-T SageBrushPearl Retired '05 RSX MagnesiumMetallic Retired '01 CL-S NighthawkBlackPearl Retired, Tranny #1 RIP @ 23,000 miles

07-23-2002, 9:30 AM	#6
IntegraVT Stealthy A-CL Member Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: WNY, NJ Posts: 1,324	Mark II - __________________ '09 RDX BasqueRedPearl '08 TL NighthawkBlackPearl '06 MDX-T SageBrushPearl Retired '05 RSX MagnesiumMetallic Retired '01 CL-S NighthawkBlackPearl Retired, Tranny #1 RIP @ 23,000 miles

07-23-2002, 12:15 PM	#10
jts1207 Duck Fuke! Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Back in NC Age: 34 Posts: 4,003	what is it...........a rear wheel drive camry __________________ 03 CL-S 6speed Nighthawk Black Beater: 04 G35C 6 speed Brilliant Silver

07-23-2002, 12:57 PM	#12
JagV12 V6 & V12 Owner Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Arizona Posts: 67	It looks like the I35, Q45 and LS430 had a threesome!! __________________ 2003 Honda Accord Coupe EX V6 (silver/black) Mods- Injen CAI Magnaflow Cat-back Exhaust(with my stock tips) Neuspeed Upper Tie Bar Evolution 8000K HID Purple Kit Hyper Ground System Acura TSX 17" Wheels & Tires

07-23-2002, 9:44 AM	#8
Black CL-S 4-Life Floyd Mayweather Jr. Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: The City of Syrup Screwston, Texas Posts: 14,107	I've always wanted to know what the Toms Chaser was ever since I won one on Gran Turismo 3.

07-23-2002, 12:13 PM	#9
StanMan Registered Member Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: soCAL Posts: 2,424	isn't the windom the equivalent to the es300? i know it was for the last gen. the chaser kinda looked more like the last gen of camry's. mark II is kinda corolla-ish, especially the headlights.

07-23-2002, 1:11 PM	#13
Tom2 Resident Asshole Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: New York Posts: 3,305	I thought that the RX300 was the best selling Lexus?? __________________ Everyone PLEASE give me POSITIVE reputation points!! I don't want any more NEGATIVE rep points!

07-23-2002, 1:55 PM	#15
shaHn78 Fell off my Rocking-Chair Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: In a different State of Mind Posts: 1,840	my 2 CENTS.... There's no way they would get rid of or replace the current ES models for 2 very simple reasons: 1 - Like all luxury divisions, the entry level cars, such as the ES are the bread earners of the company. They can either make or break the compant. Thats why so much is riding on cadillac's CTS, STC, TITS whatever the hell its called... too bad its gonna be a bomb. :P 2 - the ES is selling like pancakes... and like someone mentioned its sales are up 89% from last year. So they'd be total NUTS to try to change or replace it. And about all models being RWD in lexus' stable, i think MOST buyers dont really know the difference so they could careless as long as it rides the way they want. People buy lexus for its overall quality and its smooth luxurious ride more then anything else, and its only ppl who want a bit of SPORT, like us, who get turned off by them. Many ppl on this board think the ES is just a fancy CAMRY and dont think much of it. Well the same implies for our TL which tries to stay in the shadows of the ACCORD, which really is the reputation earner for honda. Plus the TL & ACCORD share more parts then do CAMRY & ES.

07-23-2002, 2:03 PM	#16
moomaster_99 Banned Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Somewhere between here and there, yet neither. Posts: 9,564	2.5L I6 Turbo....sounds suspiciously like an Altezza...

07-23-2002, 4:44 PM	#17
1SICKLEX Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Everywhere Age: 32 Posts: 45	ES will be a ES 330 in 2 years FYI (along with the GS 330 and RX 330 and SC 330). THe ES 300 is selling 7k cars a month, proving you don't need to be in a horsepower war to sway buyers. Plus the ES has a following and a brand of a very reliable car. RX 300 is the best selling luxury SUV, ES 300 will regain the best selling entry level luxury car.

07-23-2002, 4:46 PM	#18
CLpower teh Instigator Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Ashburn, VA Age: 28 Posts: 43,664	they need to bring over a good fun little car. The sc's are cool, but way to fuckin heavy.

07-23-2002, 5:29 PM	#19
1SICKLEX Trader Rating: (0) Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Everywhere Age: 32 Posts: 45	n20 junkie gave it away bub.... Well, the MR2 is light enough, not a Lexus but a helluva car.